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iStoleYourProfit: A story of my iPhone startup infiltrated by a Con Man
Updated 3 months, 3 weeks ago
Source: http://www.connersc.com/
Disclaimer: This is a personal account of a series of events I was directly involved in. This is merely my perspective. Any third party accounts that would like to argue otherwise are free to say whatever they want and I won’t argue with them because I simply don’t care. This is not an attempt at Internet libel as I am merely relating my own experience as I remember it. I’ve changed most of the relevant names to protect myself from litigation but would really like to expose this ...
- 102 comments on this story
Showing 67 relevant reactions out of 102.
Without signing agreement to do “work for hire” in advance of actually doing the work or a signed assignment of copyright for the specific works, then any code you have written is yours. If they ship it or make a derivative without your permission then they are infringing on your Copyright. You have more options than to just walk away. Talk to a lawyer.
Like you, I ran into a con man about 25 years ago and it had a profound effect on my thinking, even though in our case it resulted in no loss to our organization.
1. It’s not your fault. The people saying you are naive have never run into a professional con man. It is very hard to detect one if you haven’t seen one before. Maybe you were inexperienced, but so is everyone the first
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What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company ... http://www.connersc.com/blog...
Home Businesses: What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company ...: The par.. http://bit.ly/pOpGT
Yep. This guy was going to fuck up anyway if he's that stupid.
Im really glad that you shared your experience with us!
Scott you seem very naive.
In the beginning, what did you really need Tanner for? Brainstorming sessions? No real capital inflow from the guy.
It seemed like after you involved him, the iPhone app become more about an adaptation of his studio than an iPhone app to help people.
I don’t think he was a con-man. Although he definitely had a domineering personality.
Rediculous
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Im sorry but anyone who swallows the whole “The Secret” bull like you did is lining themselves up for it.
You made several, nay a multitude, of classic business mistakes that are so naive you come across like a kid.
Firstly, you have to remember the mantra: “There are NO friends in business”
Secondly, if it aint on paper, it aint worth sheeeeet.
Thirdly
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[...] the whole story here: skottie aggregated by [...]
Terrible story, and I’m really sorry for you.
And I hate to say this, but it has to be said: beware the con-men in government who promise you untold riches and freebies in exchange for your vote, too.
What Tanner did was borderline illegal, and nasty… but if he was a politician, and doing it in government, people would call him “a man of the people.”
So
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Or I would at least have a "Redditor" "discover" their true identities and post them here.
Serves you right if you ask me. A lesson learnt the hard way.
it was his arrogance that got him tripped up and nothing else. the mystical crap was just the snare. it could just as easily have been a charming woman or man for romantic interest, a heart-pulling disabled child (at least a good story about one), or just a plain old get-rich-quick spiel.
word to the wise. arrogance. not good.
Scott, thanks for the story and I sympathize that things did not work out as well as you would have hoped.BUT having re-read your post a few times, and obviously not being involved at all, I am not sure that Tanner is the malicious con man you make him out to be.
ie being a douche != a con man && things not working out != being manipulated.
For example:
1. Additional
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You make a lot of great points and in some cases I will agree with you.The cut to Zen club had little to nothing to do with its brand or the photoshoot. While it was "helping" - I will agree - he owned the gym and blurred the lines between what was his partnership and what was the gym - and wanted an equal share cut between him AND his gym.
2. Absolutely true.
3. I asked to meet the
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Whats your twitter name? Good articles!!
Thank you for sharing the story. How do people morph into being manipulative con men? Good luck in the future, use the valuable iPhone coding experience you gained to kill it with an app. Get some freelancers to do some heavy lifting for you when you need it and maintain sole ownership the entire time.
What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company ...: He told me of course he was pulling for .. http://bit.ly/1CCBVC
you have a girlfriend you trust. this is rare and most important. everything else – an experience.
What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company ...: Using Samatha's real name reveals her previo... http://bit.ly/3dqd48
A lot of you are being pretty hard on this guy. It's a good story, and if you don't have business experience you can learn a lesson from it.Just because he liked "The Secret" doesn't mean he's some asshat who deserved what he got. Hindsight is 20/20 and it's obvious he had a lot of reservations throughout the ordeal. But when you're dealing with a good con artist (I have), they can make you believe ... See all content
[...] Read more: What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company … [...]
He looks pretty cool about it :P - http://www.connersc.com/blog/?p=58
Yeah, always have a contract based on who is working from the onset. I was lucky to learn this early with little loss.
I was helping a Mr. Wu in NYC's Chinatown (you'll know him if you are remotely in the community) restore and move his website as well as get his domain names back. It wasn't a lot of work but there was at least $500 worth of work involved which he negotiated down to $300 without
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What a Concept! » iStoleYourStartup: A story of an iPhone Company ...: Disclaimer: This is a personal account o.. http://bit.ly/21tDH1
[What the hell is this?](http://visualizationtools.start4all.com/2009/11/09/what-a-concept-mostly-insulting-mostly-istoleyourprofit-a-life-story-
of-my-iphone-startup-infiltrated-via-a-con-man/) It looks like the same story, translated into another language, and then back again.
Looks like an automated SEO spam tool - takes content, reorganises it and replaces a few words and pastes to a blog.
wow... that's almost as good a Philip Greenspun's little bitter tale of venture capital.
Here's a hint kiddies: if you're an intrahwebs 2.0 startup and you think you need venture capital because you're not turning a profit, you idea is fscking worthless.
As soon as he mentioned it, I found I was skipping more over the article than reading. I find my eyes glaze over if anyone mentions any of that New Age bollocks in a conversation.
I dropped a friend because he tried to get me into "The Cult Of Tony" [Robbins] and eventualyl got me to go to a weekend seminar After listening to the constant stream of bullshit from the stage [and then from my
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at least he's learnt his lesson
good point, and he´ll probably get screwed again.
ecidivism of the soul... oh, maybe i should write a book about that...
I am the author and co-founder of this failed start up. And you guys say a lot of things that were definitely true. The comments here made me realize I left some important information out. I'll try to clear these things up here.1. I never really thought that what we were doing was revolutionary. We were creating cool looking applications on a new device and that excited me. Once we had a reputable ... See all content
There's one point this highlights - even if you're working with friends, you must have a contract.You don't need a lawyer to write it (it's better, but in the early stages you can economize), but anything written paper that divvies up the IP amongst the founders will prevent a lot of heartache later on.
kudos for your honesty
This article reads like a case story out of 'Winning Through Intimidation' by Robert J. Ringer (a book anyone who is thinking about starting a startup should read). "Tanner" sounds like a Type Number 2 Master Intimidator.The author escaped with only getting the tips chopped off a couple of fingers rather than losing his whole hand (read the book and you'll understand what I mean).
What rubs me the wrong way about this story is all the references to "the iPhone millionaires" and "the millions to be made" and the "iPhone gold rush".Gee, when you're only aim is to get rich quick, it's not too surprising that you are vulnerable to being taken for others than want to get rich even quicker.
All parties involved seem super flakey.Even though he was made out to be the 'villian' and is in fact probably a douche, the guy running the zen dojo or whatever sounds like he has a good thing goin.
This story has given me the idea of collecting stories about failed startups from the perspective of those involved.
That way if you find yourself in a shifty situation you have something
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Man, what a read: http://www.connersc.com/blog/?p=58 sad face
"he paid $300 for a manual on how to make money on Twitter and gave it to me"I'm assuming that's how to make money on twitter. Sell books on how to make money on twitter for $300!
I once picked up a book at someones house titled "Everything Good About George W. Bush"; It had a nice fancy cover and everything. I opened to the first page, blank - the second page - blank..the middle of the book? Blank!I picture this $300 manual to be very comparable.
What a squalid petty affair.I think you need to keep a little perspective. You aren't the first guy to waste a bunch of time on a side project that didn't go anywhere.
1. this was a side project!?! you can't expect great results from a side project. if something happens, then great, if not, well .... you still have a job.
2. Don't you first need to _have something_ before it is conned
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I'm biased to defend founders, but in that story, I'm not particularly on the author's side.Yes, the guru was probably abusing the situation. But the author refuses to quit his job and rejects an offer for a $250,000 seed investment. The guru does provide a key connection.
Even a legit guru would have become frustrated with the author by then, and tried to get rid of him.
I'm also
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The $250,000 was not a hard offe
The money never came - the work continued after I left, and the guy is apparently in a lot of debt.
Sounds like the con-couple charged tens of thousands of leisure expenses to the business, which leads me to believe there was some revenue to speak of and at least some of that was generated by work the author completed.
Level of contribution is a highly subjective and extremely important criteria for determining ownership rights.Also, you've got to be willing to accept that you can't please everyone if you want to protect yourself from manipulation.
"This dude even got his black belt from a man trained by Chuck Norris"He got his black belt from a man trained by Chuck Norris? Wow! That's like, so impressive. Amazing. That must mean he IS Chuck Norris.
More seriously, yes, stay away from those uber-charismatic types, and trust your gut! Never do a deal with someone if it smells fishy or doesn't seem to add up. Your gut is your best weapon
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<em>trust your gut</em>
one of the more bizarre iPhone startup failure stories I've ever read: http://www.connersc.com/blog/?p=58
How horrible for you.It just shows that you have to choose your partners extremely carefully, and you must write up legal contracts that will back up your agreement.
More importantly, don't partner with anyone you don't know and trust already.
Never trust a hippyMy two worst business experiences have been with ostentatiously 'spiritual' people. It's not that they're insincere in their beliefs, it's just a lot easier for them to deceive themselves that the selfish things they do have justifications in their beliefs.
Give me a straightforward 'coin-operated machine' (as an old partner described himself) any day, you can at least trust
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Congratulations. You just blew off Steve Jobs.
I spent 5 years at Apple and Steve spends zero time blowing smoke about spirituality. He may be a private hippy, but at work he's pure business.
Which Steve was that, though? The pre-NeXT Steve who was kicked out of his own company, or Steve the White who came back from the abyss to throw the usurpers out and save the day?
Really? Not contributing to the discussion? It's a sincere point of view, based on my experiences and very relevant to the article.Probably shouldn't have led with the old 70's punk slogan though...
I'm always fascinated about how we see one of these articles every month or two.You don't have a business until you have an organization. Get a contract in place. Determine ownership before even 1 second of time is dedicated to the undertaking.
It's really not that hard.
I've been trying to study up on how conmen succeed, and how to innoculate myself against them. I've been taken to the cleaners a lot in my adult life, but one thing I've figured out is that when someone tries to manipulate me with fear (buy now or be priced out of the market forever! or with the typical threats from a lawyer), I have learned that the most effective technique I can do is dig my feet ... See all content
The Secret? Is this a joke?
Ha I actually had a similar take. The story started very nicely like a good startup story should and in my mind i thought here is possibly another good story about the pitfalls of doing startups that one can learn from. Then got to the secret part and it kind of just completely vaporized that notion and the story became how a sucker got suckered. but the real downside was that he didn't even get suckered ... See all content
He got suckered out of a lot of his time, and all of the IP he worked on.Having some aspects of a book resonate with you != being gullible, or a sucker.
The guy in the story seems well intentioned and trusting, but out of his league in dealing with people who are underhanded and nefarious. I think this was a good article about early warning signs for this kind of person, and I'm sure it was
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Amen
I'm not sure I would call the author a sucker. He had serious reservations from the beginning. His friend? Definitely gullible. But many of the decisions the author made were out of loyalty to his friend, not out of gullibility. From the start he considered the possibility that his friend was brainwashed but gave him the benefit of the doubt. I think that even the least gullible people on HN are susceptible ... See all content
Well, at least in retrospect he has "serious reservations".
ight, sucker is a bit harsh. Using it emanated more from him loving the secret more than the story that was told. But the point I pretty much failed to make was that if he felt the enterprise to be worthy, but the people not to be, it is something within his control to find new partners or continue, nothing that happened prevented that. But the story dramatizes events to the level of someone having ... See all content
Yeah when I read that "just so true" part I thought he was either being sarcastic or would come to his senses later in the story. Neither seems to be the case. It is a shame because positive thinking in the form of good old-fashoned optimism is a great thing so long as it is balanced with a healthy dose of realism. Applying positive thought naively and waiting for good stuff to happen to you is sad ... See all content
This is spot on.
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